Zircon don't allow pk drops or allow??

Zircon - Allow or disable pk drops??

  • Allow pk drops

    Votes: 74 54.4%
  • Not allow pk drops

    Votes: 48 35.3%
  • Being able to turn pk drops on and off in options via player options

    Votes: 14 10.3%

  • Total voters
    136
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Jamie

LOMCN Developer
Developer
Mar 29, 2003
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I caught a BIG carrot earlier, let me know what "you people" think about this.

Currently on Zircon there is Experience Rate and Drop Rate. (NO change to these mechanics).

All current death penalties removed (Reduced drop / exp rate).


I will add a two new stats


Unprotected Experience Rate (UER).
A Skeleton would normally give you 100 Experience Points when you kill it. (Exactly like normal)
If you have UER of 10% then every Skeleton that you kill will give you 100 Experience and 10 Unprotected Experience.
Unprotected Experience is counted towards your level exactly like normal experience.
If you die to a monster you will lose some of your unprotected Experience (if you are unlucky it could be all of it).
If you level up then your Unprotected Experience is saved and can not be lost.


Unprotected Drop Rate (UDR)
Items can be protected and unprotected.

Unprotected Items CAN be dropped on death (PvP and PvE) at Normal mir rates.
Protected Items CANNOT be dropped on death at all.

There will be two rolls on when an items goes to drop.
The First roll uses your regular drop rate only (does NOT use Unprotected Rate), If the item drops then it is a Protected item. (Exactly like Normal)
If the first roll did NOT give you the item, then you will have a second roll using ONLY the unprotected rate, if the item drops then it is an unprotected item.


Conclusion
You cannot lose anything you that you normally would have earned, but will add some value to trying to stay alive and small additional reason to fight.



How you get Unprotected Rates has yet to fully be decided, I might change Observer function to give 5% of each (Regular and Unprotected) I might also add 10% as a Base Passive.
Should I introduce Added Drop/Experience Rate to items then they will most likely be Unprotected rates.
 

Jicaa

Pooslice
Golden Oldie
Jul 9, 2003
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I agree with Ex, this could work well for both the Gankers and the Casuals :applouse:
 

Gaypex

Loyal Member
Loyal Member
Oct 10, 2015
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Whatever you decide I don't think you can go with no penalty for death, it really does just encourage griefing, personally i like the old style of exp reduction on death i.e. you're at 68% and you die you drop to 64% or something, and also death drops from mob deaths is interesting too, it stops people being able to rambo everywhere they are and actually use the tao class for what it's intended for early game.

Whatever you decide im sure will be good
 

Aldor

Dedicated Member
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Aug 16, 2013
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Would be nice if Luck/Curse didn't affect dps (and was a stat on the character, not the weapon) but instead affected the chance to get protected/unprotected items. Would then see how many of these "PKers" actually believe half of the crap they come out with.

I've personally never liked percent exp loss on death (people wont see it as free exp) due to the imbalance/risk/penalty difference between a freshly lvled high level character and a high level character on 99% exp. There's also the chance to get exactly what I saw and took part in on RF Online; Once you leveled it became the norm to grief the crap out of other groups that were lvling by luring half a map of mobs on them and then dying with 0 penalty.

I can see UER working if it was implemented in a way that was similar to how Diablo 3's bonus exp from Pools of Reflection work. It would essentially be the same thing but instead of losing what you've already earned you're only losing what you could have earned and would therefore be easier to cope with the loss (and it's not completely negated by reaching 100% of a level).
 
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Exwizz

Legend
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Feb 1, 2010
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Would be nice if Luck/Curse didn't affect dps (and was a stat on the character, not the weapon) but instead affected the chance to get protected/unprotected items. Would then see how many of these "PKers" actually believe half of the crap they come out with..

that wouldn't work at all,

luck and curse are completely fine as they are...

the chance of protected item and non protected item should be completely RNG from mob/boss, will then make protected items more valuable on the market.

the way jamie explained it sounds fine for everyone.
 
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Jamie

LOMCN Developer
Developer
Mar 29, 2003
4,797
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370
United Kingdom
Would be nice if Luck/Curse didn't affect dps (and was a stat on the character, not the weapon) but instead affected the chance to get protected/unprotected items. Would then see how many of these "PKers" actually believe half of the crap they come out with.

I've personally never liked percent exp loss on death (people wont see it as free exp) due to the imbalance/risk/penalty difference between a freshly lvled high level character and a high level character on 99% exp. There's also the chance to get exactly what I saw and took part in on RF Online; Once you leveled it became the norm to grief the crap out of other groups that were lvling by luring half a map of mobs on them and then dying with 0 penalty.

I can see UER working if it was implemented in a way that was similar to how Diablo 3's bonus exp from Pools of Reflection work. It would essentially be the same thing but instead of losing what you've already earned you're only losing what you could have earned and would therefore be easier to cope with the loss (and it's not completely negated by reaching 100% of a level).

Currently Curse from PKing is a 1 hour debuff (Stacking) on the character, it doesn't effect the item.
 

Incredulous

Banned
Banned
Loyal Member
Jul 21, 2016
562
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anyway to gain unprotected exp ?

anyway to view how much unprotected exp you've gained?

overall a like the idea though.
 

Pottsy

Legend
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Feb 26, 2004
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Currently Curse from PKing is a 1 hour debuff (Stacking) on the character, it doesn't effect the item.

Hahah cool :D nice little touch.

anyway to gain unprotected exp ?

anyway to view how much unprotected exp you've gained?

overall a like the idea though.

It literally says it in the post lol. You gain unprotected exp from killing mobs, just like you would normal exp...except if you die, you run the risk of losing it (Hence 'unprotected' exp)
 

JustAUser

Loyal Member
Loyal Member
Feb 11, 2017
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Go play marble pottsy instead of crumbling a future server with mass depression.

No pk drops= no fun

You won't get a reply from me after your 35 line whinge btw
 

Pottsy

Legend
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Feb 26, 2004
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Go play marble pottsy instead of crumbling a future server with mass depression.

No pk drops= no fun

You won't get a reply from me after your 35 line whinge btw

Wow....butt hurt are we?

Don't worry...judging by the chat on Discord, half of you scrubs won't play long anyway cause you can't solo bosses at LV20 lol! You will evidently have drops, but with punishments, let see how much PK drops really make the game for you lol!

Welcome to Mir3.
 

Jicaa

Pooslice
Golden Oldie
Jul 9, 2003
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No pk drops= no fun

Opinion.

I would actually be willing to fight without PK drops, with them on I'll just rt away.

There would be much more PvP fights going on if PK drops are off, however I am fine with Jamie's idea as it means I can just play with my protected drops and if I happen to come across a good unprotected drop I'll shall just sell it in the TM or hand it to a friend who enjoys PvP enough to be good at it.

I really want to see how many PvP players are actually willing to wear a full set of unprotected items when they could just wear protected ones.
 

Exwizz

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Feb 1, 2010
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Opinion.

I would actually be willing to fight without PK drops, with them on I'll just rt away.

There would be much more PvP fights going on if PK drops are off, however I am fine with Jamie's idea as it means I can just play with my protected drops and if I happen to come across a good unprotected drop I'll shall just sell it in the TM or hand it to a friend who enjoys PvP enough to be good at it.

I really want to see how many PvP players are actually willing to wear a full set of unprotected items when they could just wear protected ones.

unprotected or protected items wont matter people will use them regardless.... if the item is a upgrade they will use don't act otherwise.
 

Jicaa

Pooslice
Golden Oldie
Jul 9, 2003
2,386
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unprotected or protected items wont matter people will use them regardless.... if the item is a upgrade they will use don't act otherwise.

Depends on the item for me, I'd rather use a lower item with a 1-2 stat loss, over an item that means I get stalked and ganked all the time. Everyone has their own preferences when playing Mir, mine is being able to level in peace, not caring too much about bosses.
 

WargodSius

Dedicated Member
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Aug 5, 2013
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So effectively, to keep things simply, items can drop on death unless the item is protected. Easier way of describing it

People will use the item regardless imo, but I'm sure others will use protected more often than normal factoring in the obeserver mode.

Not sure the exp unprotected thing is really necessary. Seems overly complicated for a problem that isn't really there - what problem is is actually trying to counter? Dying to a mob is already **** enough as you have to run back, and now have the chance to drop unprotected items. It's not a 'fun mechanic' so I don't see it serving any purpose (imo)
 

Pottsy

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Feb 26, 2004
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So effectively, to keep things simply, items can drop on death unless the item is protected. Easier way of describing it

People will use the item regardless imo, but I'm sure others will use protected more often than normal factoring in the obeserver mode.

Not sure the exp unprotected thing is really necessary. Seems overly complicated for a problem that isn't really there - what problem is is actually trying to counter? Dying to a mob is already **** enough as you have to run back, and now have the chance to drop unprotected items. It's not a 'fun mechanic' so I don't see it serving any purpose (imo)

Oddly enough the exp punishment, i'm sure was influenced by the lack of death drop as just a dura drop was not punishment enough.

But now this has come in, the Unprotected item dropping, has just now seemed to team up with the Unprotected exp drop, instead of the exp debuff rate (Currently it's -15% exp gain after a death).

Speculating of course, could have been the intention the whole time, who knows lol.


You'd be surprised how many people will use only Protected items. I personally would use both, but certainly not my whole kit....and i absolutely wouldn't use any if i happen to be in a guild war or a sabuk war, as it's just daft lol.

Curious to see how many of the players who class drops as the game breaking choice will willingly come into all fights and wars with unprotected kit lol.
 

WargodSius

Dedicated Member
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Aug 5, 2013
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Oddly enough the exp punishment, i'm sure was influenced by the lack of death drop as just a dura drop was not punishment enough.

But now this has come in, the Unprotected item dropping, has just now seemed to team up with the Unprotected exp drop, instead of the exp debuff rate (Currently it's -15% exp gain after a death).

Speculating of course, could have been the intention the whole time, who knows lol.


You'd be surprised how many people will use only Protected items. I personally would use both, but certainly not my whole kit....and i absolutely wouldn't use any if i happen to be in a guild war or a sabuk war, as it's just daft lol.

Curious to see how many of the players who class drops as the game breaking choice will willingly come into all fights and wars with unprotected kit lol.

Ahh so on Mir3 (or specifically Zircon) there was a -exp rate given after death? Didn't know that, so if this is true then yeah OK. I was just going on the fact that it seems a mechanic that is answering a problem that wasn't there (such as in Mir2 where death is no exp punishment).

Yeah, I did say I'd expect more people will be inclined to use protected items only (as with observer mode you could go 'hunting' for people :D), but I myself would probably just use a mix. People want to PK me, **** it ok. I don't spout off about it, I just avoid it. As people who watched me try to PVP on my laptop on Marble will know, it's probably better that way :S
 

Pottsy

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Feb 26, 2004
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Ahh so on Mir3 (or specifically Zircon) there was a -exp rate given after death? Didn't know that, so if this is true then yeah OK. I was just going on the fact that it seems a mechanic that is answering a problem that wasn't there (such as in Mir2 where death is no exp punishment).

Originally on Mir3 there is no penalty for a death, drop or exp. As far as i was aware, it was just a dura penalty (But again, this could have been specific to Zircon as i haven't played Mir3 recently). This was a 20% dura fk on death across all items.

Special repair, then being every 12 hours or something, and costed an extortion amount of gold, which would make dying a problem when you had nice equipment.

This then changed to be less gold, and only for most items except for the Weapon that you could S.Repair at any time I believe this is now still the case).

The death penalty was then changed again to be only 10% instead of 20%, with an exp death penalty as well (This is the current -15% exp rate debuff). The 12 hours was also now given to items individually as oppose to a 20-30 minute 'window' that traditional Mir3 offered (For example, repair available every day at 12PM). Now upon repairing, it will be given a 12 hour timer.


Now...all together it's basically:
- 10% dura loss on death
- Unprotected Exp (To lose on death) - This is scrapping the -15% exp debuff rate
- Unprotected Items (To drop on death)
- Special repair once every 12 hours per item (Timer added to the items) - Weapons exempt and Special repair always available at boosted price as usual (I think, trying to check :P)


So a lot is being done to compensate for everyone lol. But ultimately none of this truly exists in Mir3 as we know it, except for Special repair for items, but even that was a specified window of time.

I prefer the latest changes over simply having death drops as a thing, because with a Sin capable of 1 hitting you out of stealth, it would become very stale, very quickly being unable to defend yourself lol.
 
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