Help Map Editor Query

[Nathan]

Hi all

I have my own Mir2 server I use for just me and my friends. I am brand new to map editing, but interested in using some custom/edited maps.

For some of these maps I am looking to use the main provinces such as Bichon and Mongchon, but I only want my map to contain the province up to the city walls. I have deleted all of the surrounding areas using the map editor, but not sure if there is a way to shrink the map, or transfer what I have over to a blank map? Without a solve I am concerned I will end up with really large blank areas in the map, the minimap and big map?

Hopefully I am just missing something simple, but I have read through the help section on the map editor and there are no commands to suggest anything like this is possible.

Thank you

 

[Jev]

I think Shanda produced a few smaller versions of the main provinces.

 

[mir2pion]

It is not difficult to transfer part of one map to another map canvas, in your case to a smaller one.
After reading my comments below, if you still want to transfer it, I can explain how to go about it.

But in your case, I would prefer to keep the map and do something about the big and mini maps. If you move the city to a smaller map canvas, you will have to re-do all building doors coordinates and in the server set new coords for SZ area. SZ is easy to redo but the doors are a tedious task.
That's offhand what comes to mind, maybe more things would be affected by the move to a smaller map?

When it comes to minimap, I think that one is not a problem. Just keep some area outside town walls, like the river moat, so when you come to city walls, you still see something beyond them, not just black.
As to big map, I can't quite wrap my mind around it how to make it so it would show just the town (enlarged) in the big map panel and still show your char position on it correctly.

However, did you consider plastering the map area outside town with no-walk tags? That would make the area outside town inaccessible even to RT. You would see it on the big map but that would be just like on standard maps when you approach cliffs and see something beyond them, or you see that brown soil on top of the cliffs extending beyond view. Those no walk tags are very easy to apply to selected area.

 

[Nathan]

Those are some really good points you have raised. I did previously consider just using the no walk tags, but I thought I was just cheating myself a little. But I know you are the map god, so if you are happy, I am happy lol.

Thank you both so much

 

[mir2pion]

Moving relatively small map area like BW town might be done simply by selecting the town area and saving it as object.x
But if map editor collapses when saving that object.x, then you need to split the selection to two or more parts, each saved separately as object.x
Map editor is a 32 bit program and can only use a limited amount of memory (whereas 64 bit program can use all of your computer RAM), so when the memory overflows because you selected too big a map chunk for saving, the program closes on you.

The editor has most memory available to use when it is freshly started, before it gets fragmented as you do other things in it. So when copying (grasping) the whole town, do it in newly opened editor instance. Then if it still fails on few tries, copy smaller sections and join them on new map canvas.

Grasping and placing all three layers 'Ctrl-6' is best done when you display big tile grid 'G' and also display coordinate readout 'Ins'.
Start dragging the selection rectangle from a tile that has both x/y coordinates even number (in top left quadrant of one of the big tile grid) and end the selection on both odd coordinates tile (bottom right quadrant of the big tile.
Then click '5' to show grasped object at mouse tip ready to place on map.
Now you need to experiment on which tile to click (both odd or both even or mixed even/odd) to place the object where you want it to be placed.

If the coordinates under your mouse cursor are mixed, even and odd or both odd, the object gets placed on tile over to one side, horizontally or vertically. Its been a while since I played with this and you need to experiment to get hang of it.
To have control over the result, you need in the first place to have drawn the grasping selection rectangle to fully include big tiles in it, that's why the selection needs to follow the big tile grid outlines (G). That is, it needs to start on both even coords and end on both odd coords.


The reason for this weird behavior is the back tiles are made up of four small tiles (their single tag is in the upper left tile of the four) and so they allow placing only on every other tile, horizontally or vertically. So when placing grasped object that includes back layer big tiles, the image at the mousetip as you click to place the object on map jumps to the nearest tile it can be placed on. This can be confusing if you are not quite familiar with how things work under the hood.
I wish that the object at the mouse tip (when you click 5 and it is ready to be placed on map) would 'hang' on it down and to the right, with mouse arrow showing over the first small tile where you started drawing the grasping selection. Instead the object shows up above mouse arrow cursor and to the right and in addition you get what looks like unpredictable behavior when placing the object on map. But with little experimenting you can place it where you want it.

Mind you, when placing the whole town on a new blank map, there is no issue of this sort. Also when copying or moving all three layers together, you would rarely place it on the existing map ground tiles, so it is just as well that this stays as it is without making an effort to make it more user friendly.

This grid is big tile grid G, each rectangle encloses four small tiles.

 

[Nathan]

Thank you for your in depth reply, its much more helpful than you can imagine!

I did originally think of saving the town as an object and importing it in that way, but wasn't sure what the potential "consequences" may be, so i'm glad you have outlined that as a potential solve as well.

The map does sometimes act like it has a mind of its own, but as you said, with more practice its something I am sure I will get used to.

 

[mir2pion]

When I get to make a map editor guide, I might reuse in it whatever help I made here and elsewhere.

Transferring to a new map size is worthwhile to do when you need to make an existing map bigger, so you can extend the map in some (or all) directions. The gain overrides the loss of points teleports that would need to be redone.

If you wanted only to enlarge the map to the 'East and South' directions, ie., to increase the coordinates range, you could copy the map to a bigger map size and paste it in the upper left corner of that new map, so the coordinates for the copied map content would be preserved.
In that case, you would find that you can't draw selection rectangle starting on the 0,0 tile at the map origin. Can only start it at 1,0 or at 0,1 coordinates.
So you need to sacrifice one tile column at left side, or one row at the top. Those are not important or can be copied in extra, but you need to paste the old map object in the same place on the new map to preserve the coordinates.

=====================
I have a question for experts in this connection (transferring grasped content from one map to place it on another).
Is it at all realistic (reasonably realistic) to make Map Editor program use windows clipboard instead of its own internal one? The internal clipboard has the limitation in that you can't have two editor programs open and copy paste btw them, instead you need to save the copied content as object.X, close the current map to open a new map and place that object.X on it.

I tested and you can have two instances of the editor open (the same .exe file, each with a map open (a different one) from the same directory). It would be a great improvement if they could share the clipboard.

Alternately I have been thinking if it were possible to make a second 'map tab' in the map editor program and have a different map opened in each. Then they could share the program clipboard no problem. I just don't know which of the two solutions would be more simple to implement. I think using the windows clipboard (if doable) would be just fine. Having two maps open in the same program could have unforeseen complications while using the windows clipboard should have not such hidden gotchas.