Idea for a lowrate server, high rate exp.

[Toddwhite]

Basically I started discussing this on another thread.

What would be the issue with a high rate exp server, but with low stats. Medium drop rates.

I mean if you ratio the ac amc on armours and mobs then it would be exactly the same, but spells would be more balanced.

The drag of lowrates for me is the time taken to reach the next upgrade (level up), the fact the upgrade is 0-1 Dc or its 5-20 Dc is irrelevant if the AC/hp is ratio'd. Infact it is better because spells will be easier to balance, especially on a 2.3 but even with custom coding, the formula will only have to be balanced for a smaller number range.

I think this is a good idea for a server and I'm struggling to think why it has not been done already.

I'm not making this server or anything just wondering what opinions are.

before you say 0-1 dc isnt worth levelling for... the AC will be lower, so it is. 1 DC made a difference on euro massively.

/gw

 

[Bon]

I know you think ur all knowing and that, but your really not lol.

Why is lower stats easier to balance? It will never be perfectly balanced, no game ever is, as balance is a point of opinion.

1 DC didnt make a massive difference on euro, u didnt even notice it really... 20/30 dc u would notice it.

Your basically askin for a USA server, as that is euro stats, but with faster (or wot it seems like) leveling... with the items more spread out, and most ppl didnt like that?

 

[Toddwhite]

I know you think ur all knowing and that, but your really not lol.

Why is lower stats easier to balance? It will never be perfectly balanced, no game ever is, as balance is a point of opinion.

1 DC didnt make a massive difference on euro, u didnt even notice it really... 20/30 dc u would notice it.

Your basically askin for a USA server, as that is euro stats, but with faster (or wot it seems like) leveling... with the items more spread out, and most ppl didnt like that?

No, you're not listening.

The items wouldnt just be spread out.

The boring part for me is taking ages to get a reward.... so say its lvl 20 for a poweraxe on euro and it took 1million exp. poweraxe on usa is lvl 30 but 1million exp still. That is exactly the same.

My point is, have a high rate mentality of gaining new items quick, huge item DB, so instead of needing 1million exp for a power axe u need 100k or something. (this is an example of how u reach items quik, i wudnt use euro items)

So you level quikly, but the items only go up a little in stats. so do the defense stats and hp.

and youre saying 1 Dc made no difference, but it really did... i mean 1 Dc on a ring is 2 dc more. and 2 mc definately made a difference, or you wouldnt have spent hours worth of gold on a item with 2 more mc lol -,-.

/gw

 

[Bon]

as i said ... u didnt go from dc10-60 to dc10-61 go kill a mob and go OMG U CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE! the difference came from the total amount.
If you upgraded all ur items with +1 mc giving u like 6 more mc, then ye u would notice the difference abit.

ne way for arguements sake lets say we x4 the levels and made the EXP exactly the same

so 0-40 on euro is now 0-160 on this "high low rate" server. same amount of exp to level up.

so level 160, lets say u want about 100 dc at that level.. are we talkin 700 hp same as level 40 ye?

so in them 160 levels, u gotta somehow do loads of stats, but only amount to 100 dc.

let see...

weap : 40
rings : 20(10 each)
braces: 20 (10 each)
necky: 10
helm+stone : 10 (5 each)

level 1 ring: dc0-1
level 20 ring: dc0-2
level 40 ring : dc0-3
level 60 ring: dc0-4
level 80 ring: dc0-5
level 100 ring: dc0-6
level 120 ring: dc0-7
level 140 ring: dc0-8
level 160 ring: dc0-9

so basically u gotta do 20 levels, just go gain this almighty 1 dc? or hunt for hrs to gain this almight 1 dc?

 

[Toddwhite]

as i said ... u didnt go from dc10-60 to dc10-61 go kill a mob and go OMG U CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE! the difference came from the total amount.
If you upgraded all ur items with +1 mc giving u like 6 more mc, then ye u would notice the difference abit.

ne way for arguements sake lets say we x4 the levels and made the EXP exactly the same

so 0-40 on euro is now 0-160 on this "high low rate" server. same amount of exp to level up.

so level 160, lets say u want about 100 dc at that level.. are we talkin 700 hp same as level 40 ye?

so in them 160 levels, u gotta somehow do loads of stats, but only amount to 100 dc.

let see...

weap : 40
rings : 20(10 each)
braces: 20 (10 each)
necky: 10
helm+stone : 10 (5 each)

level 1 ring: dc0-1
level 20 ring: dc0-2
level 40 ring : dc0-3
level 60 ring: dc0-4
level 80 ring: dc0-5
level 100 ring: dc0-6
level 120 ring: dc0-7
level 140 ring: dc0-8
level 160 ring: dc0-9

so basically u gotta do 20 levels, just go gain this almighty 1 dc? or hunt for hrs to gain this almight 1 dc?

I'm not saying 1 dc was a huge difference, i was saying having a kit that was all +1 dc made a difference, this is splitting hairs u know what i meant...

It doesnt have to be exactly as low as euro... and you can add things to items other than dc, such as you might just get acc+1 and the same dc on some items... or an extra ac, you also have base DC to play with.

you seem to just be trying to win an arguement than make up valid reasons as to why it wouldnt work, maybe you could even input improvements as to how you would do it rather than discredit mine... oh wait...

edit: Hp would need to match the items and ac amc on items, it completely depends on this.

/gw

 

[Bon]

my arguement is that there is no perfect server, low or high rate....... if they want to suvive they will all have to progress and eventualyl stats will be a lot more than what it orginally started, look at wow and ne other long runnin game, when it launched the max stats were liek 100 and now its like 1000.. same with all the servers ive made

your arguement is that low rate is easier to balance etc...... what im saying is when a year has past and every1 has way more than low rate stats, what then?

 

[Toddwhite]

my arguement is that there is no perfect server, low or high rate....... if they want to suvive they will all have to progress and eventualyl stats will be a lot more than what it orginally started, look at wow and ne other long runnin game, when it launched the max stats were liek 100 and now its like 1000.. same with all the servers ive made

your arguement is that low rate is easier to balance etc...... what im saying is when a year has past and every1 has way more than low rate stats, what then?

then you have had a server which has lasted a year, which is good?

I am not saying this will make a server last FOREVER, no server will.

I think it will prolong and help with balance.

/gw

 

[squall777]

Dont see the whole point in this really.

Low stats basicly mean:
1)Really low variaty of kits.You obviously cant have tons of kits for every lvl since u want low stats.
2)Too similar stats on items.I really dont agree 0-1 or even 0-10 stats are noticeable AT ALL.Maybe 10-10 or 0-20 but deffo not less.So this kinda defeats the purpose of boss hunting.If you get a dc0-5 ring why camp for days for a dc0-7 ring lol(you said items sorta rare...)??
3)Obviously on the server you have in mind orbs are a big NO.After all what would be the purpose of a low stat server if you could get +40 stats through orbing.(making orbs super rare is as good as removing em really)

That server sounds REALLY stupid tbh.It would be just a lvling race since all that would matter would be lvls.Any1 would prefer having +10 lvls (even if its only +10hp per lvl) instead of +5dc lol.

If nething the other way arround could work.Make max lvl10 or something.Have tons of high stated items.Start with 1000hp at lvl1 and then just get +100hp raise per lvl etc.That COULD be fun.

 

[Toddwhite]

so why did people camp for weeks to get a +2 item on euro?

how can you even say 0-5 dc would make no difference on a mob with low hp and no ac this would make a huge difference.

for example if you had 10-10 dc and a hen with 0-0 ac with 100 hp, you would kill it in 10 hits. with 15-15 dc you would kill it with 7 hits, meaning you would level like 33% faster?

I actually don't think people understand the whole concept of DC/Ac/Hp is just maths. You know these games were originally dice rolls etc? its just a fancy GUI that hides the maths code?

/gw

 

[squall777]

Ye m8 i got no idea about maths really.

Your 5-5 upgrade example worked well on 100hp mob.

Now try with dc60 and a 1000hp mob or 500hp mob.

 

[Toddwhite]

Ye m8 i got no idea about maths really.

Your 5-5 upgrade example worked well on 100hp mob.

Now try with dc60 and a 1000hp mob or 500hp mob.

would be the same...

a 6000 hp mob with dc 60-60 would take 100 hits to kill.

with 65-65 dc it would take 92 hits to kill it.

there is no reason why you would have a 6k mob though if it wasnt balanced, you could edit the hp as you wish. so even if it didnt work on a 6000 hp mob, just make the mobs hp 600 lol -,-

 

[squall777]

Euro is/was boring.Low stats are boring.If euro was launched at same time with say FourHeroes u think it would have over usercount 50 lol?

Why every single euro clone died fast?Surely it wasnt the exp rate.Even at slow-ish euro clone you could reach lvl40 within 5days max.So gotta be something else.

Neway imo all there is to mir atm since lvling died long time ago(ppl fed up lvling again and again and again) is boss hunting and pvp.You boss hunt with hope to get an item that will greatly improve your stats and perhaps make it able to solo in a new cave and obvious raise your stats for pvp.So you need tons of different kits that have stats that make a difference.

I wouldnt play a server with drings power rings and omaspirit rings even if it had 812730173012 new features and 1237127x exp.

 

[Toddwhite]

Euro is/was boring.Low stats are boring.If euro was launched at same time with say FourHeroes u think it would have over usercount 50 lol?

Why every single euro clone died fast?Surely it wasnt the exp rate.Even at slow-ish euro clone you could reach lvl40 within 5days max.So gotta be something else.

Neway imo all there is to mir atm since lvling died long time ago(ppl fed up lvling again and again and again) is boss hunting and pvp.You boss hunt with hope to get an item that will greatly improve your stats and perhaps make it able to solo in a new cave and obvious raise your stats for pvp.So you need tons of different kits that have stats that make a difference.

I wouldnt play a server with drings power rings and omaspirit rings even if it had 812730173012 new features and 1237127x exp.

but the dc 0-9 on a new kit with the extra ac amc would make u able to fight in a new cave, and would make a huge pvp difference. Just like on euro lvl 22 armour made it possible to pot BC, 33 armour was needed for ZT.

I dno i dont think im getting my point across very well.

euro clones suck, would need to be all custom. never said it was a euro clone.

 

[NightScare]

Dont see the whole point in this really.

Low stats basicly mean:
1)Really low variaty of kits.You obviously cant have tons of kits for every lvl since u want low stats.
2)Too similar stats on items.I really dont agree 0-1 or even 0-10 stats are noticeable AT ALL.Maybe 10-10 or 0-20 but deffo not less.So this kinda defeats the purpose of boss hunting.If you get a dc0-5 ring why camp for days for a dc0-7 ring lol(you said items sorta rare...)??
3)Obviously on the server you have in mind orbs are a big NO.After all what would be the purpose of a low stat server if you could get +40 stats through orbing.(making orbs super rare is as good as removing em really)

That server sounds REALLY stupid tbh.It would be just a lvling race since all that would matter would be lvls.Any1 would prefer having +10 lvls (even if its only +10hp per lvl) instead of +5dc lol.

If nething the other way arround could work.Make max lvl10 or something.Have tons of high stated items.Start with 1000hp at lvl1 and then just get +100hp raise per lvl etc.That COULD be fun.

ive thought about that.

 

[squall777]

The whole argument fails.You are right on everything you posted math wise etc but that sht wont work on a mir private server.

When ppl get a heaven/mir item dropped or wotever the rare set is they like gainning 5-5ac/amc and 5-10mc from a SINGLE item they worked hard for.Having many of those rare items gives you a nice advantage over a noob that has basic lvling kit.Same way some1 in ethereal kit raped every1 on lvl70 lvling kit on Fourheroes.After all that guy supposedly worked hard for it(well it could of been donated there but thats different subject).

When i boss hunt and eventually get lucky getting couple items i want the effect being visable on pvp.Else why would i spend hours camping bosses instead of lvling??I dont just want to do 5-10% more dmg over some1 in noob kit.I wanna do double dmg or something if u get me(obviously exagerating here).Thats wot motivates me to lvl/boss hunt etc.To be significantly stronger than some1 else.Not 5% stronger lol.

 

[NightScare]

The whole argument fails.You are right on everything you posted math wise etc but that sht wont work on a mir private server.

When ppl get a heaven/mir item dropped or wotever the rare set is they like gainning 5-5ac/amc and 5-10mc from a SINGLE item they worked hard for.Having many of those rare items gives you a nice advantage over a noob that has basic lvling kit.Same way some1 in ethereal kit raped every1 on lvl70 lvling kit on Fourheroes.After all that guy supposedly worked hard for it(well it could of been donated there but thats different subject).

When i boss hunt and eventually get lucky getting couple items i want the effect being visable on pvp.Else why would i spend hours camping bosses instead of lvling??I dont just want to do 5-10% more dmg over some1 in noob kit.I wanna do double dmg or something if u get me(obviously exagerating here).Thats wot motivates me to lvl/boss hunt etc.To be significantly stronger than some1 else.Not 5% stronger lol.

thats were the whole balance argument comes in, you cant players with a significant e.g (double damage) over other players, regardless of kit, as it just takes all the skill outta the game.

say 1 v 1 on a wizz, U v sum n00b u can 2hit him he barely touches you = NOT balanced., thing about euro was even on a lvl 23 warrior i could kill complete idiots at level 44+. thats wat everyone wants to bring back, but just wont happen as the community way to self obsessed and like you said, everyone likes to work for major advantages over other players, hence ruining balance, id say FH is the closest to balance you could get, once u hit the 150-190 mark!.

 

[Bon]

well the reason i worked hard on euro, was because i knew i could sell the items i gained for ££... plus it was something to do, i only played euro when there was no good servers.

also u didnt rly "grind" for items on euro... u just waited until u got lucky drop lol, there wasnt rly any grindin features on euro apart frm challenge system which got extremely boring

 

[Toddwhite]

I think it would work, it doesnt have to be euro stats, just low.

Be easier to balance.

lvling wudnt be slow.

/gw

 

[Stratz]

I am sorry if I either repeat or argue bout something that wasn't brought up because I did not read all of the posts. But I read some people saying that only high rate servers are fun and what not. That's such bull. Cause high rate servers are all the same. You get 200+ in hours worth of playing and all the kits are the same. How is fighting someone who has the exact same kit and same lvl all the time no matter how much longer you been playing any fun?

Most of you guys seem to be talkin bout how stats are on items. And people only seem to think DC20-100 stats or better is the only way to go yet what he is sayin is, if you have people at levels 35-45 with normal iron armour and a great axe and such which was like ac0-8 amc 0-6(estimated guess) and the great axe was DC8-26(estimated guess). How is that really any different from being lvl 250 with dc500-1200? All that's really different is it higher and hurts more, which takes away having skills in pvping, hunting bosses with group/friends/guild, not being able to solo bosses.

I will say this. Today's mir players are soo ****in lazy that they don't want to spend couple of days of hunting to get a really good item. They want to be able to get the best items, the maximum level possible, within a whole days worth of playing. And that is what makes mir sooo boring. Not the old style of mir. The old style of mir you always had somethign to do cause it was so hard to kill bosses by y ourself, it was hard to get items, and it was valuable to fight for a boss that spawned not every 5 minutes, but actually took an hour or two maybe more to spawn. It's the fact people don't like that because they are lazy once again, and want to be able to do every single thing on the server by themselves. They want to be able to kill anyone by themselves, any mob/boss by themselves and thats just way tooo boring of a server cause your always gonna be by yourself.

As for balancing a server.... will never happen. You can not balance a wizzy fighting a warrior or a tao fighting a warrior or wizzy fighting a tao. They all have advantages and disadvantages. That's the way it should be, otherwise everyone is gonna be the same class. Why would you want to run a server with everyone a wizzy or everyone a warrior or everyone a tao? That's just down right retarded.

Basically what I am saying is, I agree with Toddwhite. Low stats actually makes fighting and hunting more fun/important. Low stats allows you to have to be hit more than once to die.

 

[DiabloDoom]

People are lazy because they have done it all before, and the fact that High Rates get more users than Low Rates proves what people want.

Doesnt matter if the stats are 1000+ or 100+ in terms of balance etc, but most people don't want to spend a week solid lvling to get 2 levels and then spend a week camping bosses to get a minimal increase in item stats.

The only Low Rate i'd play would be ben's, as it would probs be up long enough to actually get drops etc