State of Crystal

[Tai]

ive given plenty, and even spoken in private about this, you can easily see my history in private channel

I found the thread I believe you're referring to, from 2019 lol

So explain the proposed rule further to me...

1. What do we do with server X if you report to us that they're using something without your permission? Are they banned or what
2. Do they need permission or is credit acceptable? If so what does that look like? Is it in game or on the advert?
3. How do we verify a genuine report against a hoax?

 

[MasterD]

I'm looking at it from a very user end view here but I think free sharing of files/libs etc is how mir 2 grows. I do however completely understand why that doesn't happen due to the time + effort that's gone into very custom files.

On terms of policing my above point if it ever did happen. People need to be responsible for there own actions, if you decide to play a copy or a pop up cash grab server then you need to take some responsibility. We have all probably been burned in the past with pop ups, if you don't learn from that then that's on you.

 

[Hercules]

• How do we get this community back together, working together to improve the files?
• How should we "Police" servers? Serious answers please on what we can do.
• Any rules that need changing?
• Who is actively or actively willing to report bugs in the crystal files?
• Who is willing to help iron out these bugs?

My opinion/solution is focused on Crystal itself. And the future of content/private servers here:

Best way to find exploits/bugs:
LOMCN host Crystal server (take over from similar to what jev has done for his database).

Who will run it:
LOMCN staff members have a private chat and all have rights to reboot if needed. They obtain LOMCN GM tag here.

Who in charge of database additions:
@Jev (if he agrees)

Who in charge of code additions:
LOMCN GM and @Far (If he agrees).

Who will have final say for changes:
LOMCN can post thread changes in the Crystal section. (Community polls don’t always work, better to let LOMCN front run these and take ownership).

How to fund it:
Players have to obtain £5 LOMCN support role in order to play.

In my opinion If LOMCN actively take ownership of a Crystal Server. The community will follow. Folk are here to be apart of something. To enjoy their hobby. Currently all private servers here are to advanced/custom in order to push back changes. The only base like Crystal server here is @Jev s one.

What will it bring:
- Exploits found and reported as the community grows on the server. (It isn’t a race…if exploits are found then yes great they can be fixed).
- Better official community engagement, as it will have more of an official feel.
- Future branch offs of new servers from the code being more advanced. Meaning a better future for LOMCNs server list.
- More future private servers from new ppl. (Not just the same faces).

 

[Skyline]

My opinion/solution is focused on Crystal itself. And the future of content/private servers here:

Best way to find exploits/bugs:
LOMCN host Crystal server (take over from similar to what jev has done for his database).

Who will run it:
LOMCN staff members have a private chat and all have rights to reboot if needed. They obtain LOMCN GM tag here.

Who in charge of database additions:
@Jev (if he agrees)

Who in charge of code additions:
LOMCN GM and @Far (If he agrees).

Who will have final say for changes:
LOMCN can post thread changes in the Crystal section. (Community polls don’t always work, better to let LOMCN front run these and take ownership).

How to fund it:
Players have to obtain £5 LOMCN support role in order to play.

In my opinion If LOMCN actively take ownership of a Crystal Server. The community will follow. Folk are here to be apart of something. To enjoy their hobby. Currently all private servers here are to advanced/custom in order to push back changes. The only base like Crystal server here is @Jev s one.

What will it bring:
- Exploits found and reported as the community grows on the server. (It isn’t a race…if exploits are found then yes great they can be fixed).
- Better official community engagement, as it will have more of an official feel.
- Future branch offs of new servers from the code being more advanced. Meaning a better future for LOMCNs server list.
- More future private servers from new ppl. (Not just the same faces).

That sounds great, for official content, which is what we want the base files to be.

What happens when the player base burn through this content? We don't want to be going down the route of adding new caves, towns, magics, monsters, features etc as it then becomes a run of the mill server.

We'll end up back at square one.

 

[Fusion]

My opinion/solution is focused on Crystal itself. And the future of content/private servers here:

Best way to find exploits/bugs:
LOMCN host Crystal server (take over from similar to what jev has done for his database).

Who will run it:
LOMCN staff members have a private chat and all have rights to reboot if needed. They obtain LOMCN GM tag here.

Who in charge of database additions:
@Jev (if he agrees)

Who in charge of code additions:
LOMCN GM and @Far (If he agrees).

Who will have final say for changes:
LOMCN can post thread changes in the Crystal section. (Community polls don’t always work, better to let LOMCN front run these and take ownership).

How to fund it:
Players have to obtain £5 LOMCN support role in order to play.

In my opinion If LOMCN actively take ownership of a Crystal Server. The community will follow. Folk are here to be apart of something. To enjoy their hobby. Currently all private servers here are to advanced/custom in order to push back changes. The only base like Crystal server here is @Jev s one.

What will it bring:
- Exploits found and reported as the community grows on the server. (It isn’t a race…if exploits are found then yes great they can be fixed).
- Better official community engagement, as it will have more of an official feel.
- Future branch offs of new servers from the code being more advanced. Meaning a better future for LOMCNs server list.
- More future private servers from new ppl. (Not just the same faces).

I 100% agree with this, if LOMCN made server, i feel it would bring some life into the game, would bring all players to one big server, think it would have a feel of official server, i even like the idea of €5 a month to gain access to it with no shop this should cover costs easy.

I would like to see offcial/clone server with a big user count

and going the right direction with server following offical servers path.

If this was to ever happen please dont just do it for mir 2.....

 

[xXxLegendxXx]

I wanted to make this post after seeing some messages throughout the last few months.
This post is my OPINION and is being written as a Mir 2 player and not a staff member, due to this I will NOT be moderating this thread and will leave moderation to other staff members.

Examples of messages I've received:

1: Far has left crystal development and therefore I don't see why I should contribute to a source with no active developers.

2: Crystal is filled with bugs after the experimental branch was merged with the master branch.

3: Far refuses to fix bugs.

4: LOMCN doesn't care about P2W servers and that's why the Mir 2 community is dying.

5: The developers of Crystal have left Crystal because they found how profitable it can be just to work on code for private sources.

The above are not copied and pasted from the messages I've received and I will not say who said each message under LOMCN's rules.

How I feel about each comment:

1: Far has left crystal development and therefore I don't see why I should contribute to a source with no active developers.

R: This message absolutely infuriates me, Crystal is an OPEN source project so I don't see what difference it makes to have 0 or 100 developers that are dedicating all their time to the source code.
We all have the ability to push updates to the repo and the attitude that "I won't push updates because Far won't" is the attitude that will truly make Crystal fall.

2: Crystal is filled with bugs after the experimental branch was merged with the master branch.

R: Crystal has a combined total of 202 total bug reports under its belt and the majority of those fixes have come from Far directly. A lot of people were upset with the new forms that were added to the Item and Monster database. This was down to them being released with some pretty major bugs and some missing content. Both the old and the new forms are still usable in some form.
There are bugs with both the old and new forms which have now been reported by Win.
Around 40 bugs were posted in the last 2 days on the repo and yet these bugs were found ages ago. Can't expect bugs to be patched if no one is reporting them.

Another issue with the bugs is that: SOME server owners that use crystal have patched these bugs without reporting the bugs and also just don't feel the need to push any fixes toward the open source.
This is usually down to "I paid money to have the bug fixed so why should I bother to release it to everyone?" And that's a very fair point but it's the same people that say that then moan about the state crystal is currently in and also moan that Far has moved away from crystal.

3: Far refuses to fix bugs.

R: Take a look at the repo's commits ffs.
A lot does come from server owners which is great but a lot also comes from Far. When he left the development of crystal he made it clear that he would still fix major bugs.

4: LOMCN doesn't care about P2W servers and that's why the Mir 2 community is dying.

R: I like my mod position.

5: The developers of Crystal have left Crystal because they found how profitable it can be just to work on code for private sources.

R: So they're doing exactly what most Server owners have been doing for years? Patching bugs privately and profiting from it. disheartening isn't it

To summarise (@mir2pion learn from this )

Crystal is in a bad way in my opinion and I don't think Far coming back in itself will be enough to truly bring crystal back up.
I think anyone that runs a crystal server needs to step up and actually try and help strengthen the code you have based your game from, I couldn't imagine how disheartening it must be for the developers of Crystal looking at all the negativity towards bugs and updates when they are also giving their free time to try and make a game that you then can go and build on. No wonder why they all left to go do other things.

I ran a Public Crystal Test server and I received a lot of bugs from the players. The list of fixes for my database are huge in the last few months and that's all down to people contributing and reporting bugs. Guess how many players on average the server got? 5, 5 players for the first few weeks and I managed to report over 20 bugs on the open source.
Couldn't imagine how healthy the open source could be if everyone reported the bugs they found and if server owners who have fixes for bugs could push it for everyone.

We are meant to be a community, start acting like one. Help each other out.

Go to sleep lol, get gud

 

[Jev]

Go to sleep lol, get gud

Learn to spell you tramp

 

[Damian]

As much as I enjoy the game, like most people in this community my time is limited and certainly not free if there was some kind of bounty system in place for features or bugs you would likely see much increased activity that benefits everyone, people are willing to pay privately so why not just make it public.

 

[LightBringer]

• How do we get this community back together, working together to improve the files?

Can you?
There were a couple of huge contributors and then some people willing to contribute with fixes they find.

Unless everyone using the public source works together and contributes it'll never really work.
As you have the people who want to make the source better, and the leeches who want to just get fixes etc without any intention of contributing themselves.


Unfortunately our TPR source is way different to the public source so we never can really contribute to fixes directly.
As and when I go through testing, I can flag stuff I find, however it may not be present in the public source.

 

[Ardbeg]

The remit was originally to make the source as close to the official as possible.
As mentioned in the thread, the ASpeed issue is a good example of where things go wrong.
If the main source interpretation of the official game is wrong, fine, try and correct it to be close to official. However, do not try and change it because one or two people don't like how it works with their own setup. Let them change it on their own server and not the main source.

Far worked hours and hours on the files so it's hardly surprising that he's got bored with them.

One idea that would help these files and any future files is to fund additions to the source.
If the files need an addition then a target value of £x could be put on the work. Individuals and server operators would be encouraged to make donations towards the target. Once reached, Far, kynd, Lcd or any other competent coder could be offered the job and paid £x for the work.

Might be a bit simplistic but it's far shorter than my original response !

 

[Sanjian]

I found the thread I believe you're referring to, from 2019 lol

So explain the proposed rule further to me...

1. What do we do with server X if you report to us that they're using something without your permission? Are they banned or what
2. Do they need permission or is credit acceptable? If so what does that look like? Is it in game or on the advert?
3. How do we verify a genuine report against a hoax?

yes thats the original reference there have been others since. your reply in that thread is also the reason its feel pointless to mention it any more but a question was asked and i gave my thoughts on it.

1. i would say if its evident that its been stolen from a lomcn user then that other lomcn user should not be allowed to advertise X server. you dont allow a server to advertise with stolen server files, so why is client files any different? im not talking about files that are accessible or bough from other sites, im talking about a clear copy and paste from other peoples code, why is stealing server code not acceptable but stealing client code is? its not just images its actual code. if person A can prove person B has stolen designs or code then it should be enforced.

2. yes they should have permission from the original creator. a simple statement saying they have been given permission is good enough. EVERY server advert is approved before published and every lomcn user looks at new server adverts.

3. if a person cant prove they are the original creator then they have no case.

lets give you some examples, seeing as lets be honest, its only my fkin work that getting stolen and its only me that has a problem with it....

Same ols stolen GUI **** i see on every egyption server, its why i moan about them

MirAlliance 11th November 7:00PM UK

Join: Discord Download: Autopatcher This server will offer a wide variety of AIs for the end game bosses where it won't be smash and heal and basic way to kill boss it will be full of mind games for you to explore and adds a taste to the PVE of Mir not just a simple hack and slash PVE so...

www.lomcn.org

Ariss Mir 2

when is it live ? as it says it was ment to be yesterday ?

www.lomcn.org

Legend Of Mir2 FourHeroes.

FourHeroes/ Mir 2 Welcome to The Legend Of mir II FourHeroes -GameMasters Are :GameMaster And BeGM -Active Gms and listen to ppl Beta Date:20Jun 12PM LaunchDate:25June 12:00PM -Downloads- Removed by Admin -Server Discord Channel - Removed by Admin Server Details: Classes Available: Warrior...

www.lomcn.org

those last 2 the assets are available ina shanda client but they dont look like thta, i customised them, those are custom designs i made and thats client CODE stolen not just images

heres my ORIGINAL work

The Legend of ̶ M̶i̶r̶ Fishing [Custom Crystal]

Full Client: http://mir2resource.co.uk/LegendOfFishing/LOFClient.7z AutoPatcher: http://mir2resource.co.uk/LegendOfFishing/LOFLatest.7z * * * LOF Goes Live 3rd August 2018 - 6pm GMT * * * The Legend of ̶ M̶i̶r̶ Fishing WTF.... Firstly i wanted to do something completely...

www.lomcn.org

Post automatically merged: Mar 2, 2023

oh and to prove i did that monster bar herers the original WiP png for it




EDIT: had to delete one of them he actually ASKED permission

but for reference its here

Post automatically merged: Mar 2, 2023

That sounds great, for official content, which is what we want the base files to be.

What happens when the player base burn through this content? We don't want to be going down the route of adding new caves, towns, magics, monsters, features etc as it then becomes a run of the mill server.

We'll end up back at square one.

i think an "Official LOMCN" server is a great idea... the issue is lomcn were going to do one with conquera files and that got abandoned, amazing starter hype.. no commitment from all involved.. and died a nasty lonely quiet death.

personally if lomcn did do an original server based on korean, players cant burn through the content because the officials been going for years and we would be starting just now.

 

[Hercules]

When’s Crystal opening? @Tai make it happen, set a date and stick an advert up offering rights to play via support role here

 

[Jev]

When’s Crystal opening? @Tai make it happen, set a date and stick an advert up offering rights to play via support role here

Both the crystal repo and my database is not at a stage where I feel comfortable doing a Live release.
Need developers to actually contribute to the code as well otherwise you’ll just see bugs coming in and them staying open.

 

[Hercules]

Both the crystal repo and my database is not at a stage where I feel comfortable doing a Live release.
Need developers to actually contribute to the code as well otherwise you’ll just see bugs coming in and them staying open.

Like we saw tho bud we fixed a good hundred issues and the code ones remain un fixed if there are any still, it needs the official feel with more staff involved to get it progressing.

As I said it isn’t an official server to race and polished. It will have exploits and bugs and will crash. But that’s the point

 

[Jev]

Like we saw tho bud we fixed a good hundred issues and the code ones remain un fixed if there are any still, it needs the official feel with more staff involved to get it progressing.

As I said it isn’t an official server to race and polished. It will have exploits and bugs and will crash. But that’s the point

I’m happy to keep my public test server up and running as I continue to work on the database and will keep the server running with the latest code and database.

Should hopefully see some bug fixes coming soon

 

[daneo1989]

lol, not even staff want to speak out in case they get demoted/banned speaks 1000 words itself that does

We do discuss p2w servers and OldSkool was the last one.

 

[Seanofsmeg]

4: LOMCN doesn't care about P2W servers and that's why the Mir 2 community is dying.

R: I like my mod position.

Your such a drama magnet when you make comments like this haha make us mods sound like robots working from Amazon do this do that or be fired! . Think you have just had a bad experience or two with comments that were better started in the mod channel for everyone to discuss and see what action to take but we can 100% voice our opinion.

I will post my opinion (that may or may not be the same as other mods)... P2W's are the most easiest and most difficult thing to sort.

First we have to find the line. Where we stand as mods and what our role is then vice versa for server owner / player. I think the role of mod is to provide a place where people can find Mir servers. Some good ones some bad ones. We should remove unsafe ones but bad and unsafe aren't always the same.

If someone submits an application to advertise a server we should only deny it if it breaks a rule otherwise that's pretty sht to say No you can't advertise your server (good or bad) you have worked on for 3 months, 6months, 2 years because I don't think people will like it. Up to the player to decide.

On the other hand we could have people report a server ad if they feel its P2W and if 5 people vote that your server is P2W... BANG! we remove it, ban you from advertising ect ect.. EASY!

So yea.. easy to fix in a way that will cause more issues and hard (border line impossible) to fix in a way that will please all. I think posts like this are good though to gather ideas.

 

[OuYangPlane]

I wanted to make this post after seeing some messages throughout the last few months.
This post is my OPINION and is being written as a Mir 2 player and not a staff member, due to this I will NOT be moderating this thread and will leave moderation to other staff members.

Examples of messages I've received:

1: Far has left crystal development and therefore I don't see why I should contribute to a source with no active developers.

2: Crystal is filled with bugs after the experimental branch was merged with the master branch.

3: Far refuses to fix bugs.

4: LOMCN doesn't care about P2W servers and that's why the Mir 2 community is dying.

5: The developers of Crystal have left Crystal because they found how profitable it can be just to work on code for private sources.

The above are not copied and pasted from the messages I've received and I will not say who said each message under LOMCN's rules.

How I feel about each comment:

1: Far has left crystal development and therefore I don't see why I should contribute to a source with no active developers.

R: This message absolutely infuriates me, Crystal is an OPEN source project so I don't see what difference it makes to have 0 or 100 developers that are dedicating all their time to the source code.
We all have the ability to push updates to the repo and the attitude that "I won't push updates because Far won't" is the attitude that will truly make Crystal fall.

2: Crystal is filled with bugs after the experimental branch was merged with the master branch.

R: Crystal has a combined total of 202 total bug reports under its belt and the majority of those fixes have come from Far directly. A lot of people were upset with the new forms that were added to the Item and Monster database. This was down to them being released with some pretty major bugs and some missing content. Both the old and the new forms are still usable in some form.
There are bugs with both the old and new forms which have now been reported by Win.
Around 40 bugs were posted in the last 2 days on the repo and yet these bugs were found ages ago. Can't expect bugs to be patched if no one is reporting them.

Another issue with the bugs is that: SOME server owners that use crystal have patched these bugs without reporting the bugs and also just don't feel the need to push any fixes toward the open source.
This is usually down to "I paid money to have the bug fixed so why should I bother to release it to everyone?" And that's a very fair point but it's the same people that say that then moan about the state crystal is currently in and also moan that Far has moved away from crystal.

3: Far refuses to fix bugs.

R: Take a look at the repo's commits ffs.
A lot does come from server owners which is great but a lot also comes from Far. When he left the development of crystal he made it clear that he would still fix major bugs.

4: LOMCN doesn't care about P2W servers and that's why the Mir 2 community is dying.

R: I like my mod position.

5: The developers of Crystal have left Crystal because they found how profitable it can be just to work on code for private sources.

R: So they're doing exactly what most Server owners have been doing for years? Patching bugs privately and profiting from it. disheartening isn't it

To summarise (@mir2pion learn from this )

Crystal is in a bad way in my opinion and I don't think Far coming back in itself will be enough to truly bring crystal back up.
I think anyone that runs a crystal server needs to step up and actually try and help strengthen the code you have based your game from, I couldn't imagine how disheartening it must be for the developers of Crystal looking at all the negativity towards bugs and updates when they are also giving their free time to try and make a game that you then can go and build on. No wonder why they all left to go do other things.

I ran a Public Crystal Test server and I received a lot of bugs from the players. The list of fixes for my database are huge in the last few months and that's all down to people contributing and reporting bugs. Guess how many players on average the server got? 5, 5 players for the first few weeks and I managed to report over 20 bugs on the open source.
Couldn't imagine how healthy the open source could be if everyone reported the bugs they found and if server owners who have fixes for bugs could push it for everyone.

We are meant to be a community, start acting like one. Help each other out.

Am I the only one who is a stand-alone player? It is only my hobby to participate in the development and assistance of crystals. It is also a pleasure to communicate with everyone. Any GM has the obligation to update and repair codes for crystals, which is also their responsibility , Seeing the above question, I am very sad and sad, but I will continue to support the information and code of Crystal

 

[Ardbeg]

Am I the only one who is a stand-alone player? It is only my hobby to participate in the development and assistance of crystals. It is also a pleasure to communicate with everyone. Any GM has the obligation to update and repair codes for crystals, which is also their responsibility , Seeing the above question, I am very sad and sad, but I will continue to support the information and code of Crystal

I'm much the same.
I had planned to use Crystal to replace my old Ruby server but, with the lack of Heroes, removal of 800 x 600 res and only a few people playing it, I haven't made the switch.
The recent addition of heroes rekindled my interest but they're not that well implemented and I have no time to really try and code anything.

I usually just ignore all this bleating about pay to win etc. because people are in control of their mouse and they don't have to play the game.
How many of those who complain are coming from a moral standpoint anyway, it seems to me that jealously could be lurking somewhere ?

No set of files ever seems to get finished on Lomcn. Just as the code reaches the final hurdle, another set of files comes along and draws coders away to something new. They run for a bit and the same happens to them.

 

[OuYangPlane]

Are you still active on the Korean server?

I'm much the same.
I had planned to use Crystal to replace my old Ruby server but, with the lack of Heroes, removal of 800 x 600 res and only a few people playing it, I haven't made the switch.
The recent addition of heroes rekindled my interest but they're not that well implemented and I have no time to really try and code anything.

I usually just ignore all this bleating about pay to win etc. because people are in control of their mouse and they don't have to play the game.
How many of those who complain are coming from a moral standpoint anyway, it seems to me that jealously could be lurking somewhere ?

No set of files ever seems to get finished on Lomcn. Just as the code reaches the final hurdle, another set of files comes along and draws coders away to something new. They run for a bit and the same happens to them.